Still searching but some good advice here.
If you wire the DB as follows the multi will monitor the grid (ET112) and switch off non-essentials when the grid fails. Otherwise it will power non-essentials from PV and Battery (and grid if needed).
AC1 - essentials
AC2 - non-essentials
Here you go. Step by step and all questions answered.
Happy reading, its a very informative thread.
Thx everyone!
The reading was very informative.
CONTEXT
- new install with victron multi 15k+ RS450/200 with 18x550w north facing + 15kwh 1 c batts (for now)
- I want to control that non essentials do not drain batt (not too concerned about peak loads) but have access to PV during both grid on & loadshedding to maximise usage
- I want to be able to control non essentials using batts , not totally exclude, like when substation blows again or cable theft ie 3-14 days loadshedding. For this I have spoken to 3 people on similar size systems and all have removed db split and gone to manual or some form of automation but to ensure they get to choose when to use batteries for non-essentials based on batt SoC (like the SS does on aux port
- Happy to use grid when available during early eveing 5-8pm) and early morning 5-8am) to power non essentials and save battery. Absolute Min 11 hour (6pm-7am) evening usage is 7kwh with no cooking/ showering in this time etc (but geyser still on).
- Understand that solar requires whole house to be trained and briefed on compromises including that large loads will either be staggered (geysers) or off at certain times like evenings and overcast (e.g ovens & stove and sometimes geysers). Gas geyser failover seems a necessity if marriage is to outlast solar expedition.
CONCLUSION
- There seems 2 options but both require some manual/automation intervention. Opt 1 is split db and insert doomsday switch and manual /automate PV to Non essentials when grid down and PV enough (which could be 2x a day). Opt 2 is manual/automate non essentials to protect battery SOC during certain parts of the day and staggering loads including using eg cbi smart switches and power indictators etc and particularly cater for overcast days though manual/automate (seems the next rabbit holeš). @JacoDeJongh recents comments on cbi astute and HA is noted.
Of the 2 options I prefer opt 2 (ie manual override for overcast days rather than daytime loadshedding) and as everyone has stated, I will only know once I have lived with the system and the choices made but nothing then stops me implementing opt 1 later if first choice does not work.
Thx again everyone, will defintely rack some more forum members brains once up and running and the automation bug starts biting!!
Regards
You have to āliveā with the system for at least a year to get to know it and how your weather/climate will affect it. Winter vs summer sun trajectory etc and your energy consumption profile. There is loads of improvements to me made but you will only figure this out over time.
I managed to do everything I wanted with some automation (the CBI Astute switches and similar wifi timer devices) but my mods are ancient and rudimentary compared to what some of the folk are doing here (Home Assistant, Node Red etc which are things I know nothing of)
BUTā¦I sized my system (eventually) so that even if the 5Kw inverter runs full taps, the batteries will hardly break a sweat and I do keep an eye on things daily when inclement weather looms.
Many safeguards that you can program in the Victron inverters.
Where are you situated?
Me like āKISSā.
Automation is a given, it is going to happen. But keep it simple. If you are not around, will the system make perfect sense to the next person who knows nothing of your clever ideas/automation?
My geyser comes on, using a Shelly, depending on what the Victron stats are. KISS.
If there is bad weather, geyser goes below a certain temp, then it is overridden by the Shelly.
So my two cents:
Split the DB, all stuff that you want to keep clear of the batteries during LS, is on that DB. The Non-Critical Loads. Stuff like geysers/oven/stove.
However, IF you want, once you know your loads, you can install a āDoomsday Switchā IF NEEDED to switch the Non-Critical loads back to Critical Loads, managing them only then to not overload the inverter, drain them batts.
Titbit:
I had plugs added to the kitchen for MW, kettle, air fryer, induction plate, that are carefully monitored if there is LS. Wife looks at the āChristmas treeā lights on the inverter.
Lots of LEDās displayed, no-LS.
Less LEDās = LS.
It makes sense to her. Iām happy.
Pretoria
Ok we share the weather then. Iām also in Pretoria.
Anxiously waiting for this coming Friday (winter solstice). This low sun angle is hitting me hard! In summer time I peak at around 6kw. Iām lucky if I see 4Kw currently so I have to still manage loads in the house to try and get the batteries full, which seldom happens. Most days I only get it to 85%.
But that said, I run my whole house off batteries and solar so I donāt mind.
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I like your KISS principle but we live in very complex timesš when it comes to energy (I think u need a phd to just spec a half decent solar system that aligns to most/key needs, is reasonably priced for what it is and then find someone half competent to install it and navigate compliance hurdles like sseg). Simple is mostly a good start but also is great risk in reducing savings, effeciency and ease of use.
I am not concerned of maxing the inverter (if I max a 15kva multi there are other issues to address).
As to batt draining, again spikes in peak current draw for non essentials I am satisfied with (need to take manufacturer at their word on performance for now), battery life i think can be sorted 90% with smart switches. I have to in any way have smart switches for day/night whether db split or not. This seems to be a good addition to the CBI Astutes to achieve similar outcome but with remote app override.
CBI Astute Smart Power Indicator (ASPI) | CBI-electric (Circuit Breaker Industries).
Again not seeking to go offgrid but definitely want max return on investment.
Having the ability to divert PV during loadshedding to non essentials is a design priority. For now I think will start conservative on usage (foresee huge shock for family) and then gradually expand. I however have 3 weeks of usage data so can see daily peaks/lows, avg use during day/night etc so luckily not an outright guestimate.
Thx for taking the time to respond.
PietF I ended up with what you are doing - I think its the best approach.
To make it easier I put a few of these in my DB (after the normal breakers) to control the heavy power users https://www.takealot.com/smart-wifi-geyser-timer-with-energy-metering-smart-life-tuya-app/PLID91403075
With these I can turn the big consumers on and off from anywhere (I know most people dont like the tuyas that much but I have settled on an all tuya system)
They are a bit cheaper and smaller than the CBI astutes so I preferred them.
Thx @tvic
The more I read and learn from others the more I conclude db split seems a lesser/limited solution than smart switches, especially for inverters with no Aux port. Switches also sets u up for the next phase of automation in HA, Nodered etc which is also becoming the norm expectation not the exception. If it fails u can always revert to alrm reminders and manually switch on/off (old school). Proof of the pudding will be in the eating.
As fyi, I phoned cbi today and their aspi (loadshedding switch) its still pending final approval with no firm date for launch. Did confirm on other channels eta of 1 Aug. lets see.
U right Tuya has similar devices though do look lesser quality hardware than cbi, but seems better software platform and native HA integration. Wonder if the tuya aspi could switch cbi astutes if all in tuya app?
Do you have any info on this??
Nope. Only whats on the cbi website.
Not sure if the Haultron pricing is pre release as Cbi did mention something about pre order. At R530 this would be good. However this combined with cbi astutes and then added into the tuya app and then HA should give a very good start in controlling non essentials in a smart way.
Ok. 
Just wait for HA to break with a forced upgrade.
Or Node RED upgrade because it is āthereā ā¦ you itch to update.
Or a switch goes.
ā¦ Been there, dunnit all.
Or lightning strike close by and a bunch of them switches blow. (has happened to others, not me)
The lesser/limited (simplest) solution is always the most elegant WHEN stuff goes sideways.
KISS.
I donāt give advice. Anything I say must be checked and re-checked.