Monitoring your geyser temperature

/tldr: the water cylinder is probably less important than the pipes. Likely more useful steps: heat the water in whatever source cylinder once a day to above 50-60°C, if particularly cautious do this heating closer to the time that the water will be used, allow the water to run for a minute or two before use and if extra, extra cautious don’t take a 30 minute shower and if extra, extra, extra cautious turn of the shower tap in between lathering etc. I am not paying anyone’s medical/funeral bills.


Caveat - I am not a Microbiologist, or any of the ologists.

Others are better suited to answer, and have actually done so, the technicalities of the proposed system. My perspective is more around the perceived risk that Legionella actually has in a residential water system and whether any extra steps are required.

As you indicated Legionella is likely in the water in any case and most people seem to focus on the geyser/hot water cylinder as an incubator for further multiplication. Some folks at US did a bit of research and found Legionella even very close to the element in an electric element geyser.

Element_Scraping

Combining quantification of Legionella in five real world geysers with computational fluid dynamics, that simulate temperature stratification to evaluate whether an environment that is conducive to the growth of Legionella exists, they developed an infection model to determine whether infection is likely.

Two of their conclusions stand out for me

the infection model seems to indicate that Legionellosis from single household plumbing systems is unlikely except in the case of immunocompromised individuals.

and

the CFD model- and biological-results presents a strong case for the growth of Legionella in piping systems downstream of the water heater

*emphasis my own

With regard to the first highlighted conclusion, developing Legionnaires Disease from Legionella requires 4 things

(i) presence of a virulent strain in a water source (or soil in the case of L. longbeachae), (ii) means for dissemination (aerosolisation) of the bacteria, (iii) environmental conditions allowing the survival an inhalation of an infectious dose of the bacteria, (iv) a susceptible host

So, (the correct variant of) Legionella must be present, and you must inhale enough of it while having an immune system that might struggle to fight off the infection. Point 4 seems particularly relevant - so if a transplant recipient for instance, or underlying chronic medical condition, or really old/infirm more caution is advisable.

With regard to the second highlighted conclusion, these folks even found some Legionella in low flow shower heads. I will wager that throughout South Africa, during summer, most water pipes in the roof space of houses will likely provide a better environment for Legionella to thrive than the geyser (which through periodic very high temperatures will have a partial sterilization effect).

So, why do we not have many more reported cases of Legionella related illness? Between 1 January 2018 and 30 September 2020 the NICD were notified of (only?) 93 cases of Legionellosis in South Africa. One reason will be that it is under reported for reasons like low surveillance and patients inadvertently being treated for something else (like TB) that also treated the Legionella related Pneumonia.

A fairly recent study of a sample of high-rise buildings in Hillbrow (!) found Legionella in 31 of 67 samples taken from 15 different buildings. If the Legionella related infection rate was truly problematic I suspect there would have been some TikTok videos by now of 10’s-100’s of people dying (yeah absence of evidence and all that…). It is possible that these buildings contain mostly baths and not showers (aerosolisation is way more likely during a shower).

Another reason is possibly that water system related incidence of Legionella related infection is actually quite low (like the Stellenbosch model suggests). This, I speculate, might partially be understood in how most people are likely to approach a shower. I suspect most people will have the water running for a while before jumping in the shower. The Stellenbosch folks found that the water from the hot water tap contained more Legionella initially than when the water had run for a while - thereby (my hypothesis) reducing the likelihood of being exposed to a high enough dose of Legionella to be a problem for most healthy individuals as most of the “free floating” Legionella is flushed from the pipe before exposure.

So, unless falling in a very high risk group, and/or wanting to boil the water for other possible Pathogens I think extra steps/costs specifically focussed on Legionella are not needed in a single family type residential setting.

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Going back to the OP’s question I have found that the thermostat well is a pretty good place to measure the temperature of the water.
And you can usually shove a couple of sensors into it if required…

Fun fact, last week I saw on a Youtube video and now I can’t find the specific video again, that the SANS code actually states geyser water have to be heated to 55 degrees at least once a day to kill the goggas.

Heya!

You might want to check out a smart temperature sensor that can easily attach to the side of your geyser. There are units available that measure the surface temperature and then estimate the water temperature, sending the data to an app.

Something like the GROVE - Temperature Sensor or a Smart Geyser Monitoring System could do the trick, as they let you track the temperature remotely. Let me know if you come right!

Thank you! Can you point me to a link or site that has these units? If I search under Grove temp sensor I get units that does not look capable of connecting with wifi and sending data to an app.

It would be much appreciated.

I have been using the Geyserwise with the Tuya app or Thingwala conversion, works quite well.

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Geyserwise wifi is simple as a standalone but you will need to do some wiring and add the thermostat.

Sonoff th16 (or whatever the newest is called) is simple and you can just glue the temperature probe onto the metal plate or a pipe or if your geyser has the extra port for renewable, you can add a temperature probe.

Of you’ve got home assistant, you can make a simple esp home with a simple esp device.

Just bear in mind that the temperature is very different at the top, middle and bottom of the geyser so really depends on what you want to use it for.

Their system doesn’t use the regular thermostat. This is replaced with their temperature sensor and over temperature switch.
Since this is in the center of the geyser the temperature is reasonably accurate.

I replaced the thermostat in my Kwikot Solar geyser with the Sonoff DS18B20 Waterproof Temperature Sensor, which is connected to a Sonoff TH. This setup monitors the temperature and controls the geyser via a 30-amp relay.

This system has been running reliably for over four years.

Now, Sonoff offers the WTS01 Waterproof Temperature Sensor and updated relays capable of handling the required amperage, eliminating the need for an external relay.

Additionally, everything operates through Home Assistant and is flashed with Tasmota.

I want a device that:

  • Does not require me to replace the thermostat or element or whatever, or drain the geyser and drill new holes etc.

  • Is a simple temperature sensor that I can stick/glue somewhere on the outside of the geyser which is wired to a wifi module thingamabob device that can connect to wifi and preferably comes with an app

  • I want it only to show me when I am close to the geyser’s set temp of say 60 degrees by making an estimated calculation based on what it measures outside.

But now that I think about it, this is probably not possible because the outside of the geyser is still cold to the touch, even with 60 degrees temp inside.

This fits into a 15mm/20mm Conex coupling…

Please dumb (plumb) it down for me.

So where exactly does this brass enclosure go that will house the sensor? It seems as if it must be somewhere in the pipe and presumably the the geyser’s outlet pipe where warm water will actually flow.

If this is the case, it will only work if once a warm water tap is opened? This is still acceptable, but will it mean that I need to drain the geyser for this installation?


The t piece can be installed at the hot water outlet so no need to drain the geyser. Just isolate the cold water supply.
This should be self explanatory…

Thank you, I understand.

Where/into what does that cable terminate? How are you reading your water temp?

This I got from Geyserwise.
These are sold for R1k but can be bought easily second hand:

It’s a NTC temperature sensor compatible with many controllers…